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SamC
White Water Yakist
3467 Posts |
 Posted - 2005-10-31 : 11:46:22
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| This is more of a musing than a real problem, but it can be entertaining to pursue a problem for whimsy now and again.It would be a useful tool (for me) if I had a JavaScript that would take the "selected source" on a page and calculate the Flesch-Kincaid reading index - (or possibly any of several reading indexes). The algorithms are pretty simple, but one little parameter is required that isn't so simple to calculate... the number of syllables in each word.If you want background or would like to see the formulas, here are a couple of links that discuss the various reading indexes and their formulas:http://juicystudio.com/services/readability.phphttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flesch-Kincaid_Readability_TestIs there a way to get syllables per word without a dictionary? If a dictionary database is required, then that's another kettle of fish. (If you have knowledge of an suitable dictionary DB, any info would be appreciated). (I guess I could learn to access a DB from JavaScript).Sam |
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spirit1
Cybernetic Yak Master
11752 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:15:26
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i thought that number of syllables is equal to number of vowels. if there are none then it's one syllable.isn't that so?Go with the flow & have fun! Else fight the flow  |
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jsmith8858
Dr. Cross Join
7423 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:17:29
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| spirit -- "Boat" has 2 vowels, but one syllable. And so on ... |
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spirit1
Cybernetic Yak Master
11752 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:20:06
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silly english... complicates things that much...  so then... how do you guys define a syllable??Go with the flow & have fun! Else fight the flow |
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jsmith8858
Dr. Cross Join
7423 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:34:14
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| A "syllable" is a pronounciation thing; the number of "beats" it takes to say a word. In musical terms, the # of syllables a word has is often the number of notes in the melody it matches. i.e., "Hap-py Birth-day" -- each word has 2 syllables. "To You" -- each word has 1 syllable.Many (all?) languages, not just English, do NOT have a 1:1 correlation between vowels and syllables.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syllable |
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spirit1
Cybernetic Yak Master
11752 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:38:21
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| yeah... we don't here's it's basicaly the rule i said previously...Go with the flow & have fun! Else fight the flow |
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TG
Master Smack Fu Yak Hacker
6065 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:40:17
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| >>so then... how do you guys define a syllable??I agree that it's a pronounciation thing. coin: one sylablecoincide: three sylables (co~in~cide)I'm sure there are (complex) rules to count sylables but I'll bet there are plenty of exceptions.EDIT:I guess if you misspell words (like syllable) it's even harder :)Be One with the OptimizerTG |
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mcrowley
Aged Yak Warrior
771 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 12:58:40
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| Hmm. A vowel followed by a consonant should indicate a syllable, as well as a trailing -y or a trailing -le. Then there is the word Diary. DANG! |
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Arnold Fribble
Yak-finder General
1961 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 13:00:16
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| You certainly need to turn it into phonemes first, and for that you'll need a dictionary.'he had had in his possession a bunchberry plant', as they say in Nuxálk. |
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spirit1
Cybernetic Yak Master
11752 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 13:59:01
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| sam what are you working on??lately you had some cool feature requests... i'm intrigued...Go with the flow & have fun! Else fight the flow |
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Michael Valentine Jones
Yak DBA Kernel (pronounced Colonel)
7020 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 14:06:57
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| Don't forget acronyms. Is it S-Q-L or se-quel?CODO ERGO SUM |
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SamC
White Water Yakist
3467 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 14:30:17
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quote:
Originally posted by spirit1
sam what are you working on??
When I get involved reviewing course content, we copy the content into MS-Word which can calculate the Flesch-Kincaid grade level (It's a configuration option in the Word spelling-grammer checker under Tools/Options). We like to dumb text down towards 9th grade if possible, even for techical subjects. Often I don't take the time to do this because of the number of steps.There may be improvements to the "vowel method" (e.g., any word with 2 vowels under 5 characters is a single syllable), which would make it accurate "enough" for use. I may give it a go when I have the time.Sam |
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Michael Valentine Jones
Yak DBA Kernel (pronounced Colonel)
7020 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 14:37:41
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| Why not use javascript to load it into a Word document and use the method available there to make the calculation?CODO ERGO SUM |
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SamC
White Water Yakist
3467 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 14:46:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Michael Valentine Jones
Why not use javascript to load it into a Word document and use the method available there to make the calculation?
I haven't any experience interacting with MS Office through JavaScript. Have you?Sam |
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Michael Valentine Jones
Yak DBA Kernel (pronounced Colonel)
7020 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 15:08:03
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Sorry, no experience using MS Office with javascript, but I have seen it done.I just come up with ideas, I don't actually implement them. CODO ERGO SUM |
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jsmith8858
Dr. Cross Join
7423 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 15:32:32
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| When you say "javascript", it sound like you are implying that a web page will do this. I would have the web server (not client) process this request, and then you can use VBScript (for ASP) or any of the .NET languages (ASP.NET) on the server to instantiate a Word Application object and go from there.You would create a Word.Application object, create a new document, insert in the text that is submitted to check, and call whatever method of Word you need to get the value you are looking for. Recording a macro in Word and checking the code generated may be helpful for finding this out. I didn't see this option specifically in Word 2000, but I only looked briefly. |
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spirit1
Cybernetic Yak Master
11752 Posts |
Posted - 2005-10-31 : 15:48:43
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| but that means you need to have word installed on your web server which i don't think is that great...maybe you can use OWC. don't know if they have that functionality.Go with the flow & have fun! Else fight the flow |
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jen
Master Smack Fu Yak Hacker
4110 Posts |
Posted - 2005-11-01 : 00:36:04
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| don't know if it's related or you can use it, but visual basic has a cool tool, "genie", it's a text reader and i think you can use it to highlight syllables. I've only used in as an "alarm" so far.i found this but haven't opened the filehttp://math.hws.edu/eck/cs124/javanotes3/source/TextReader.java--------------------keeping it simple... |
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